Karen Spens is the president of BI Norwegian Business School. She received her PhD from Hanken School of Economics in 2001 and became Professor of Supply Chain Management and Corporate Geography in 2007. She has since held several administrative positions at Hanken and in 2015 became the Rector of Hanken. She has mainly taught Supply Chain Management and has primarily published in the field of Humanitarian Logistics.
Watch Karen Spens’ full interview with Stellar Woman Magazine below:
So who is Karen Spens? What’s your backstory?
Thanks for inviting me. It’s my pleasure to be here today.
One important thing women need to do when trying to move forward is to be daring enough to take on a new challenge. I was bold enough to leave my native land; Finland and move to Norway. I am a Finnish citizen. I lived in Finland most of my life. So naturally, moving to Norway was a truly exciting but also a daunting prospect. I however had the experience. I was a Rector of Hanken School of Economics in Finland. And before that, I was the Dean of education. I had gained expertise in teaching and learning and dealing with students which of course made it easy to make the decision of moving to BI. BI as you may be aware is a very prestigious and large institution of learning. I received my Ph.D. from Hanken in 2001 and I wrote extensively about healthcare logistics. I became the professor of supply chain management and corporate geography in 2007. At that time not many people wrote about logistics but I wanted to do something different. I love research but I always prefer that it has impact on people, business and society; which explains why I worked from a healthcare perspective. So for the past 15 years, I’ve worked with humanitarian logistics or disaster logistics: a much needed topic and service particularly during the pandemic. Sadly, I don’t get that much time to do research being the president of BI. I do plan on doing research in the future. I’m currently focusing on my life and my residency here in Norway.
What was your childhood dream career? Are you doing that today?
I love music. I started playing the violin when I was four years old and I dreamt about becoming a violinist. At some point in time though, I realised I probably wasn’t good enough to have a career in music. So I decided to study business and was quickly invited to be an assistant at Hanken School of Economics. Working there made me realise I wanted a career in academia. I set out to get my PhD, and on that journey discovered my passion for research. Having done quite a lot of research for sometime, I realised that the next step would be, becoming a professor; which is the dream for people working in academia. And after working as a professor, I took the next step by becoming the Rector. Unfortunately, there aren’t many dreams about becoming Rector/President; this is mainly because you don’t get much time to do research.
So many of my colleagues would say that I switched to the ‘dark side’, which of course, is administration. Regardless of these views, becoming the Dean of Education was a step in the right direction. It was something I enjoyed and it made me curious about taking it on as a career. I certainly like taking things holistically, using my logistics background to actually help the whole school not just by doing research, but by involving myself in its administration.
Does the violin get played at all?
Yes, I do play my violin sometimes but that’s not for anybody else to hear. It’s more for my pleasure. I played at some weddings but that was for good friends. The other thing that I really loved is singing in the choir. So I am hoping that at some point again, I will be able to do that here in Norway because that’s one of the things I have really missed being part of. Just being able to make music and play in concerts. It is a wonderful thing. So hopefully at some point, I will be able to get back on track with my music.
As a striving woman, what are your ideal stellar woman attributes?
One great stellar woman attribute is a woman who trusts and believes in herself. This is because if you believe in yourself you’ll have the power to help others.
The other attribute is a woman that makes other women shine. I truly think that’s what a stellar woman is all about. It is not only about making yourself shine but also helping other women find their strength.
BI Norwegian Business School was listed among the “Best Executive Education providers globally” by the Financial Times ranking 2023. Congratulations!! Please share how this makes you feel and what makes BI that good.
What I think has made BI so outstanding is our keen focus on excellence. BI began in 1943 as a teaching school, so the focus has been on exactly that; the teaching. High quality education is the priority of BI, and being in the top rankings of education has been a way for us to prove that we deliver high quality executive education. We focus on student-centric learning and being connected to the society and other businesses. This is absolutely necessary when trying to make it on these rankings, especially as an institution of executive education.
How important is FT ranking and why is it important to ensure that the
programmes are valued by the corporate world?
I think we have over 250,000 alumni. So, almost every third person you talk to in business has either done a course or has had an actual education from BI. So, in that sense we are doing very well in the Norwegian market. Everybody here knows about BI. However, from an international perspective, rankings are really important. If you want to be visible in the international market, especially in terms of attracting faculty and students, then being in the rankings is crucial. For a business school, it is truly important to be seen. Of course, all the accreditations are important as well, but the ranking plays an important role in international visibility.
Being at the top, please share with our subscribers, lessons you’ve learned in decision-making.
I think one of the most important lesson in decision making is to include the people you’re working with. If you’re not inclusive, it feels like everything is happening behind closed doors. No one will understand why you made the decision/s; and they will be very confused. So what’s important is that even if people don’t agree with the decisions you make, at least they will know why they were made. Of course not everyone is going to love your decisions, but that’s just the way it is when you have big decisions to make.
Another important lesson is communication. So often the issue is lack of communication. So I think that however much you communicate, you will never get praise for your communication or find people thinking that it was too much communication. The key or solution is to find different channels, or different ways for people to get the message. However, I also think that people have to be proactive and take the responsibility of finding out why certain decisions have been made. So it’s not just about the leader’s communication but also the responsibility of the people in the organization to receive and understand the message: it goes both ways.
I, however, don’t think I communicate enough yet, which means I have a long way to go. But I’m constantly trying to improve and do things better.
“We’re in a unique position to impact decision making – both in business and in politics – through the cutting edge research, knowledge sharing and ability to provide future leaders with strong analytical and operational skills” was part of your contribution in an article written by Harvard Business Publishing in regards to what the future holds for higher education institutions. Please elaborate on this
I think that business schools will need to prove indispensable if they’re to succeed in solving the greatest challenges we face in the world. This including climate change, wealth gaps, global energy transition etc. We are living in insecure times and I think, business schools can be powerful in these moments. I support the open dialogue and critical debate. We (business schools) are really truly in a unique position to impact decision making through our research, which is something that is so important these days. It is fact based as it comes from reliable sources. It is so difficult to discern between what’s right and what’s wrong today. However, through the research that we’re doing, we can actually make a really big impact.
This can also be through knowledge sharing and educating the future leaders. We should be educating our future leaders to understand and learn to not only discern what’s right and wrong, but at the same time, provide them with really strong analytical and operational skills that are relevant in all sectors and industries. In fact I have just been talking to a top CEO today who emphasised that these are the skills that are needed regardless of which subject area one is in.
Another thing, that we need to do, is also to empower our students to actually take on research that has societal impact. This is one of the big key issues for business schools globally. It is thus not just about doing research, it is about doing research that has great impact on society as whole.
Could you share from your experience as a leader, what are some of the things that women need to succeed?
Well, first of all, as I said, women should just believe in themselves more. So many people ask me, “So Karen, how does it feel to be the first female president?”, since I am the first female president of BI. in 80 years! I however don’t think of myself as the first female president, or even as Karen; president of BI. I first and foremost think of myself simply as Karen.
So, believing in yourself, and thinking, “I could actually be the president just as well as anybody else” is the key to success. But at the same time, I think, as I said before, we women need to support each other more. I have always thought; if I am going to shine, I need every one around me to be just as shiny. So in that way, it’s not just about me, but about the people around me as well.
The theme for this issue is striving for excellence. What does Striving for excellence mean to you? Do you strive for excellence in both your personal and professional life?
At BI, we have excellence as one of our main goals. So in a way, excellence is in the DNA of the school. It is in all our operations, teaching and research. We always strive for excellence.
When it comes to my personal life, I don’t think about excellence in that sense. It’s more about having a balance between my work and my life; having a family and a husband as well as a thriving career. I would like to think I’m doing great at home. But having a good work-life balance is excellence to me. I like to feel like I am there for my family. I haven’t really thought about being excellent in my personal life, I just strive to be there for myself and for the people I love.
How do you go about improving excellence in a large institution like BI?
One of the most important things we talked about is BI. being an executive education institution that encourages people to be lifelong learners. Nowadays, with all these advancements like ChatGPT, if we are not on top of that, striving for excellence won’t be possible. This of course includes being on top of what we’re teaching. It’s all about encouraging people to take part in continuous education, and trying to keep up with the world in order to deliver excellence in both research and teaching. For example; we have had two people join our EMBA program, and of course other people taking other courses.
I also do encourage people to take leadership courses, have mentors and coaches. I have coaches for myself. This is because I do think that in order to be better, there’re so many things that you have to learn and think about. You may need support in those areas. So encouraging people to take courses, have mentors and coaches, helps in moving forward.
As the president of BI Norwegian Business School, it is important to align your
team to aim for excellence. How are you able to lead your team to act
consistently to support the notion of excellence?
It is truly essential to have the same goal when working with a team. If we are all clear on our common goal and why we have it, and include everyone in the decision making, then we are on our way to excellence. Since we have excellence as part of our main strategy; if we all aim to do our best ,then it makes it easier for the whole team to strive for the same thing. However, this doesn’t mean we all have the same opinion, but at least we all know where we’re going and we all agree to go.
What are the obstacles for achieving excellence at BI Norwegian Business School?
Having people who don’t do their best and misunderstanding the whole picture of what we’re trying to accomplish is probably the biggest obstacle that very easily happens in large organizations.
It’s important to consider something I have launched called Our BI. I do think people need to have a sense of belonging, and have an idea of where we’re going. However, silo thinking takes away from that. As a logistics professor, I think it is vital to consider the holistic picture and get people to acknowledge how important that is and to understand that it is not just important for me, but for us and our goals. We as an organization need to perceive these goals as important and help people understand their roles in order to achieve these targets.
What challenges have you faced during your journey in achieving success? How have you overcome them?
For me, one of the best things to do is to take one day at a time. So if you are facing any challenges, which all of us do, you have to know how to live in the moment.
I personally struggle with having to let someone go; I sometimes think of it as a failure on my part. I am trying to overcome this particular challenge and move on from the fact that I am personally responsible for that failure by not being able to keep that person in the organization. This is a true hurdle for me, but at the same time one has to be able to move forward regardless. You have to think about how you manage yourself and your thoughts as well. I always think positively; that I will do my best. And of course, sometimes you will fail. But if you always do your best then it becomes easier. To forgive yourself if things don’t go as planned. That is how I’m able to move forward through hardship and be successful.
How do you maintain a work life balance? Are you able to share how you’re able to integrate balance and make it possible?
One of the things I always tell people is to GO HOME. Don’t stay at work too long. I’ve been pretty bad at that myself though. Thats one of the things I try to improve, especially when I’m with my husband and my dog. I think, “okay, I will actually go home and not feel guilty about it this time.” But work never goes away. We women always want to do our best, don’t we? But I do think you need to take care of yourself otherwise life becomes too difficult if you don’t have any balance. So I try to go for long walks with my dog both in Finland and Norway. It’s really easy to find tranquil forests here; someone in Japan thinks that’s therapeutic. I call it forest therapy, or dog therapy. Either way it’s very helpful. Set some time aside for yourself and your family. And don’t feel guilty about that!
If you have to go back in time, what key lessons would you give your 15-year-old self?
I think I would give myself the same lessons my dad already gave me at that age. He said, “Well Karen, you can do anything you want to.” So I would actually just tell my 15 year old self to believe what her dad said. You can do anything you set your mind to. Believe in yourself, and of course, do your best at everything you do – that’s really enough.
What is your life mantra?
My life mantra is ‘you can do it’. If we look at leadership and what I’ve done at BI, I would say, ‘listen, learn and lead’. I think that’s very useful and I’ve heard a lot of people agree. I came into the organization aiming to listen and aiming to learn, now it’s time to lead. If you want to understand an organization, and you lack incredibly big ears, you won’t have a clue about what is going on around you. Leading becomes so much easier when you listen to what is being said in your organization. So all in all, you have to lead based on what you have listened and learned from. That is my life mantra.
Leave one challenge for our subscribers and listeners to help them strive for excellence. What challenge would you leave them?
I would leave them with the challenge of never giving up, believing in yourself and supporting other women.
Watch Karen Spens’ full interview with Stellar Woman Magazine below: To learn about Karen’s leadership, how she aligns her team to achieve excellence, what BI does to improve excellence, her failures, what Karen wants to see in the world and Karen’s plan for the future.